UNIVERSAL BAT VEHICLE: WELDING, TOOL MAKING, AND SPECIAL TECHNIQUES
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UNIVERSAL BAT VEHICLE: WELDING, TOOL MAKING,... Expand / Collapse
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Posted 1/24/2018 4:53:56 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

PART ONE

Sly
“Wow! that truck looks too nice to use as a donor.”

Having found an outstanding donor vehicle for my DOJ/Justice League
Batmobile I had very similar feelings while driving it home from the
car lot. “This is a really great vehicle. It seems like a shame to use
it as a donor vehicle.”

Then I realized that the qualities that made this vehicle feel like
such a great vehicle were really the same qualities that make it a
really great donor vehicle. At one point, frustrated over repeated
failures to find the right donor vehicle I had even considered buying
a brand new RAM 3500 four wheel drive chassis truck. If money had been
no significant object of resistance I would have gone that route.

What I Learned from My Experiences in Finding and Purchasing a Donor Vehicle.

Study, evaluate, decide, and re-evaluate, until you absolutely know
what vehicle you are looking for. Define your parameters such as make,
model, year, quality, condition, etc, etc,…..and put it in writing.

This statement should list every non-negotiable parameter for the
donor vehicle you are seeking. Everything else not on your list is
optional.

Don’t buy a potential donor vehicle without doing an accident search,
seeing it in person, and driving it up to 70 MPH.

Driving it up to 70 MPH is the most important. This will reveal most
suspension, drive train, and many other problems if they are there.
Many vehicles with hidden problems can still drive at 30-40 MPH and
give little indication of any problems. But at 70 MPH, shake, grind,
and shimmy.

You can find potential donor vehicles with damaged body panels,
damaged upholstery, missing doors, trunk lid, or hood. These vehicles
will be far more affordable but with more unseen damage risks than
nice-condition donor cars. Many of these will have undisclosed
accidents, damaged suspensions, bent frames, etc. Search the vehicle
accidents reports. Even a slow speed drive is better than not driving
it at all.

Choose a donor car that is free of heavy rust.

Don’t settle for less, unless you absolutely have no choices.

I made this mistake when I bought a Dodge 1500 Ram as my first donor
vehicle for my DOJ/Justice League Batmobile.

I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

Post #160233
Posted 1/24/2018 4:55:45 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867

I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

PART TWO

Determine the fair price for what you are looking for.

Use your parameters sheet and go to the internet and type in what you
are looking for. This will take you to various sites such as
autoguru.com, autotrader.com, and many others. Many of these allow you
to type in your zip code and the radius of miles you want to search.
When you find a listing that meets your parameters criteria save it in
a file with the related prices. From these you will soon develop the
market price range (low and high).

Buy intact running and drivable potential donor vehicles of the best
quality you can afford. This will give you a proven and functional
intact drive train.

For those looking for a donor vehicles as a source for frames/parts
there are auction sites like erepairables.com and many others. I like
erepairables the best.

Most of these are sold with salvage or certificate titles.

These are often classified by flood or crash damage.

Either way it means the insurance companies have declared them total
losses. To put them back on the road means after you repair them you
will have to apply for a new title if you want to put them back on the
road again.

The best vehicles are the flood damaged. (low chance of a bent frame,
and the suspension, steering, rear end, front end are all usually
intact) These usually have water soaked interiors and water caused
electrical problems.

At erepairables.com for a flood damaged vehicle you can expect to pay
around 25% of the value of a similar used running vehicle on the lot.
You can also use proxy automatic bidding.

Also, it is zip code and radius miles searchable.

erepairables.com

WORTH GOING TO IF YOU ARE LOOKING TO PAY 25% for a donor vehicle that
is very useable and intact.

Post #160234
Posted 1/25/2018 4:54:47 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

SLY

“Hey, I am getting pretty excited about my work with the DOJ 3d files.
As you may know, the plan is to mill this in foam, make a mother mold,
and produce the body parts. My timeline might come pretty close to
yours.”

“If I can produce the body panels it would be interesting to see if
they would fit on your donor.”

There is no donor vehicle that I found that would allow the mounting
of body panels without significant modifications for the DOJ/Justice
League Batmobile. However, there is one example of deductive building
logic that you have available to you, that I and others don’t have.
That is your physical proxy build.

RULE APPLIED DEDUCTIVE LOGIC: Any donor vehicle, frame, power train,
front suspension, rear suspension, etc. that will fit inside your
proxy vehicle has the potential suitability to support the mounting of
your body panels. You will also have several alignment points to
choose from that will match up to a donor vehicle’s existing
mechanical structures. The donor vehicle in this build chosen is about
compromise and value judgements. I have found no donor vehicle that is
a perfect match but have decided on my donor based on my building
techniques and matching of mechanical and structural elements within
the boundaries of the DOJ/Justice league Batmobile.

I have estimated that finding the right donor is worth 30-40% of build
completion. An excellent example of this is paul wayne’s donor
selection for his tumbler build that probably exceeds 70% or more of
the total build contribution. A closer aligned example to the DOJ is
the one built in Ecuador.

Post #160243
Posted 1/31/2018 5:56:37 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

Donor Vehicle Preparation

PART ONE

This will depend on how much of the donor vehicle will be used.

If you are just after the frame or a rolling chassis then you can just
record on a piece of paper the make, model, year, and other relevant
information that would be needed to be able to order parts.

Remove the battery, drain the fuel tank, and remove the tank.

A drained fuel tank is still dangerous due to fuel vapors and can burn
and/or explode from any source of heat such as gas cutting torches and
stray sparks from electrical shorts, grinders, saws, drills, and even
from metal on metal friction sparks.

Gasoline has a flash point of -50 degrees Fahrenheit
Flash point of a flammable liquid is defined as the lowest temperature
at which it can form an ignitable mixture in air.

Gasoline has an ignition/fire point of 495 degrees Fahrenheit
Ignition/Fire point, which is a slightly higher temperature, is the
temperature at which vapors of the flammable liquid continue to burn
after being ignited even after the source of ignition is removed.

Remove unneeded body parts from the donor vehicle. This will likely
include all doors, body panels, hood, interior, dashboard, seats, etc.
Try to recover parts in good condition as these can be sold.

Place the donor vehicle chassis on good quality, strong, jack stands.
Clean and prepare the bare chassis, particularly, if you intend to
take the vehicle to car shows. Remove dirt and grime completely before
spraying with an undercoating.

Next, update and/or replace worn suspension parts.

That’s it. You are now ready to build your Bat Vehicle.

Part Two will cover preparing a donor vehicle for significant
integration into a Bat vehicle. The donor vehicle will most likely
contribute 30-40%, or more, to these Bat Vehicle builds. vertigo

Post #160271
Posted 2/1/2018 5:21:21 PM
Supreme Being

Supreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme Being


Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

Donor Vehicle Preparation

Part Two

Preparing a donor vehicle that will be significantly integrated, into
a Bat vehicle. The donor vehicle will most likely contribute 30-40%,
or more, to these Bat Vehicle builds.

Set up a log book for your donor vehicle.

Record all identify information such as make model, year, VIN Number,
and title information at the front of the book. Since most of these
types of donor vehicles will be bought intact from individuals and
used car dealers many of them will have the original owner’s manuals
that came with when they were bought new.

Set up and label a plastic box, big enough, to keep all this
information together.

Set up a section of around 20-pages at the back of your log book and
title it MEASUREMENTS and KEY INFORMATION.

Measure and gather key information such as wheelbase, rear axle width
with wheels, front axle width with wheels, tire sizes, assembled
dually tires total width, height from ground to top of hood and any
other information you believe to relevant. Continue to add other
information as it becomes available such as front axle width without
tires, rear axle width without tires, lug nut sizes, and replacement
brake pads part numbers.

Other sections should be set up in the log book as needed to organize
your information.

Usually these log book sections will be set up by divisions such as
engine/transmission, suspension, body, interior, front end, rear end,
POL (petroleum, oils, and liquids) or other divisions that the user of
the donor feels are relevant.

Remove the battery, drain the fuel tank, and remove the tank.

A drained fuel tank is still dangerous due to fuel vapors and can burn
and/or explode from any source of heat such as gas cutting torches and
stray sparks from electrical shorts, grinders, saws, drills, and even
from metal on metal friction sparks.

Gasoline has a flash point of -50 degrees Fahrenheit

Flash point of a flammable liquid is defined as the lowest temperature
at which it can form an ignitable mixture in air.

Gasoline has an ignition/fire point of 495 degrees Fahrenheit

Ignition/Fire point, which is a slightly higher temperature, is the
temperature at which vapors of the flammable liquid continue to burn
after being ignited even after the source of ignition is removed.

Remove only unneeded body parts from the donor vehicle that you are
absolutely certain will not be used. This may include doors, body
panels, hood, interior, dashboard, seats, etc. Try to recover parts in
good condition as these can be sold. Even so, something from these may
be needed after all. Usually these needs result from changes in build
vision and the discovery of better alternative solutions to build
problems. Save everything unless you are absolutely, positively,
certain that you will not need the part again. Then save them anyway
until your Bat Vehicle donor vehicle has completed its contribution.

SECURELY LABEL AND IDENTIFY ALL ELECTRICAL WIRES, TUBES, HOSES, and
CABLES. ADD INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT THEY WERE DISCONNECTED FROM and
OTHER RELEVANT INFORMATION.

This will take time but will save you hours from chasing down wires,
tubes, hoses, and cables.

Place the donor vehicle on good quality, strong, jack stands.

Remove the tires.

Next, update and/or replace worn suspension parts.

Inspect engine and transmission.

Everything else should be inspected as well.

Carefully, with attention to details, record inspection results,
problems, and projected maintenance/replacement parts.

That’s it. You are now ready to start integrating your donor into the
building your Bat Vehicle. vertigo

Post #160276
Posted 2/2/2018 6:05:49 PM
Supreme Being

Supreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme BeingSupreme Being


Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

Donor Vehicle Preparation

Part Three

Preparing a donor vehicle that will be significantly integrated, into
a Bat vehicle. The donor vehicle will most likely contribute 30-40% of these types of Bat Vehicles.

As such, you will need to purchase some maintenance and repair manuals for your embedded donor vehicles.
I bought the Haynes and Chilton's manuals for my DOJ/Justice League Batmobile donor today for 60.00 delivered.
Some may also want to purchase the related factory repair manuals as well.
Many of these can be found at Amazon and eBay for 25-100.oo. vertigo
Post #160282
Posted 2/5/2018 6:35:30 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

Began the physical tear down of my donor vehicle and spent most of the next 16-hours on the process.
Proved to be more difficult to remove the heavy duty steel bed than I predicted.
The bed was 1/4 inch thick steel and fastened to the frame with welded 3/4 " thick steel plates.
Drained the fuel tank and purged the tank with continuous pressurized CO2.
Used a reciprocating saw with extreme cutting Diablo metal cutting blades to sever the plates through.


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Post #160298
Posted 2/6/2018 6:45:08 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
I placed a copy of this post here for the possible benefit to anyone
planning to and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

Sly,
“When I had a donor frame I was considering leaving the motor on the
end it's mounted to now, thus the front becomes the back and the back
becomes the front. Then all you need is a V-Drive and you don't need
to do much with the motor. But I only had a rolling frame so not
really sure if that idea was practical. What do you think?”

I carefully evaluated this method and concluded that it was way too
much work for what you get. Installing the engine, transmission, and
V-drive are a lot easier than moving front and rear end suspension
around.

Originally, I was thinking along the lines of full-size and movie
correct but then I decided to go street legal. I accepted that I would
have to skew this Bat Vehicle enough to fit within the 8’-6” maximum
allowable width to run it on the street.

My donor’s rear axle with dually wheels/tires mounted is exactly
8-feet wide. The combined tire measurement is 20-inches for each set
of dually tires. The wheelbase is 140-inches. It is almost like I had
planned these specifications into my donor selection.

Dramatically speaking, “After I committed my first skew on this build
and was able to fully accept giving up total movie correctness, I have
noticed how easy it has become for me to skew again, and again, with
less and less regret.”

Skewing in art and sculpture in particular:
If something is skewed, it is changed or affected to some extent by a
new or unusual factor, and so, is not expected, correct, or normal.
vertigo
Post #160306
Posted 3/1/2018 7:34:27 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
When I started my Tumbler I was a little short on money, so I started my build on 8 X 12 X 16 foundation concreate blocks (not to be confused with cinder blocks. I would have preferred jack stands but you do what you have to do.

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Post #160377
Posted 3/30/2018 9:41:15 PM
Supreme Being

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Last Login: Yesterday @ 11:11:39 PM
Posts: 1,988, Visits: 2,867
Placed a copy of this post here for the benefit of anyone planning to/ and/or actually building a Bat Vehicle.

I use meshcam/machmill on my 4 axis milling machine.
Most problems I had in the past were caused by using too fast feed rates and too fast rapids.
Motors would jump steps.
I solved most of my problems by keeping my bit cut rates SFM (surface feet per minute) (not the same as bit RPM) about 90% of maximum. and slowed my X Y Z rotation axis feed rates down until the motors quit jumping steps. Most CNC home mills used to cut foam can't reach anywhere near the operational feeds and rapids rates possible with the commercial machines.

Here is a plug in the variables SFM calculator
Milling Formula Interactive Calculator
carbidedepot.com
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